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John B

Any Knowledge on this Vehicle ?

13 posts in this topic

Found this in an old family album belonging to my Wife.

Anyone know anything about this make. It looks like Ceirand, we do not know where or when it was taken.

It does have an AA badge on the front. The van behind has oil lamps

post-17-1134773427.jpg

John B

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Here is another shot of the same car, as far as I can identify.

post-17-1135030946.jpg

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I've been doing a little digging and the best I can come up with is the car is possibly Italian but after that the trail ends

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Having delved into the web it seems that this might be Italian, although it is R/H drive. Does anyone know of an expert on vintage cars or a web site where I can make enquiries?

Have come across another shot from a side angle, which is of the same car, as far as I can tell.

post-17-1135541310.jpg

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Bit more information has emerged, which may cast some light on this subject

After a bit of delving around relations, my wife has now come up with the information that, her Uncle Sid`s Father (Debnam family name) was a Chauffeur around the early part of the last centuary.

Sid`s Father was chauffeur to the Keiser whenever he was on a visit to this country.

Unfortunately Sid died a few years ago, he was also in the Motor Trade in South Africa. I did meet him as he moved back to the U.K. when he was in his eighties.

The only back up to this is that Sid did have a mascot, claimed to be from the from the front of the Keiser`s car, which was in the shape of a globe, but this was passed on to a member of the Debnam Family.

Looking at the car in the photo`s, I imagine that this was not the car that carried the Keiser.

I have not yet checked out which Keiser was involved, or the Debnam family history, as this story has only just been told to me.

John B

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Sorry Kaiser is the correct spelling,before my much travelled Brother gets chance to correct me. nahgnah

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B) -->

QUOTE(John B @ Dec 25 2005, 09:16 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Sorry Kaiser is the correct spelling,before my much travelled Brother gets chance to correct me. nahgnah

I expect he knew old Billy's batman as well nahgnah

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No, only his wicket keeper, but nobody made up a song about him. :wallbash:

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Wrong again it is an a on the end of the name so it is in fact a Ceirano.

I will now try to follow this up.

John (Hawkeye) B

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Sorry I'm not that much into old cars but did look up the name and there is stacks. I presume you have already been there but...

Ceirano

The Ceirano brothers (Giovanni Battista, Giovanni & Matteo) were all significant figures in the early years of the Italian automotive industry.

The first company to bear their name was founded by the eldest brother, Giovanni Battista, at Turin in 1866 to built bicycles. In 1898 this company was renamed 'Ceirano & C' and in the following year the first car, a 3.5HP two cylinder Welleyes design, emerged. In that same year Ceirano sold his company to a group of investors who formed the Fabbrica Italiana Automobili Torino (or FIAT). He remained in the new company for around one year, after which he left and, together with his brother (Matteo), founded a new company 'Fratelli Ceirano', again at Turin. In 1903 Matteo left and formed 'Matteo Ceirano & C', still in the same street whilst in 1904 Givanni Battista wound up the 'Fratelli Ceirano' concern and formed STAR (Societa Torinese Automobili Rapid).

1904 saw Matteo's company renamed 'Matteo Ceirano & C - Vetture Marca Itala', otherwise known as Itala. Matteo left this latter company the following year in order to form, together with Ansaldi, a company called Ceirano-Ansaldi which then led to the formation of SPA in 1906.

Going back to 1904 and the next brother, Giovanni, founded 'Ceirano Junior & C', again in Turin. The following year saw the name change to 'Junior Fabbrica Torinese Automobili'. In 1906 it employed around 50 workers and produced 130 cars. That year also saw Giovanni leave the company to found SCAT. After the first world war Giovanni and his son, Ernesto, founded 'S.A. Giovanni Ceirano'. After a few years of competition Giovanni also took control of SCAT, and in 1925 the cars began to be built with the name 'Ceirano' replacing SCAT.

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Thank s Doughnut, I had to blow the picture up to get the name off the front of the car, and read the O as D. After getting a clue that it might be Italian I tried an O and came up with similar information that you have found.

I was interssted to find out that the Brothers started off making Bicycles, moved on to motor Cycles, and in 1899 produced there first car.

I have emaied a Classic Car site, and asked if anyone can give me more information on when this car would have been built, and why would the British market at that time want an Italian car ? Were our vehicles trailing the Italians at this time, or was it a status thing in those days, as now ?

I will update this if the information arrives, as I am finding a few old photos can bring up an insight into the world at that time.

John B

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And to think I spent hours, nay days trudging through the murky waters of Goooooogle, constantly getting sidetracked, all because someone don't know their D's from their O's :baaa::baaa:

:compute::wallbash::rantoff:

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You just can't get the staff nowadays Ted

:new_bluegrab:

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